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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 10, 2020 10:01:32 GMT -5
I'm assuming that this is the correct forum for the Durango 1/2 ton? We have placed a deposit on a 2021 D283RLT. The advertised specs say a hitch weight of 1310, but the door sticker is 1530 lbs. We purchased a new RAM 2500 Diesel Laramie Longhorn (6ft 5 in bed) to tow a 5th wheel. It has a towing capacity of over 19000 lbs, but a meager total cargo weight capacity of 2108 lbs. (Front axle 6000 and rear axle 6040 GAWR.) I now am aware that we need to stay as close to the 2108 total cargo capacity as possible. I am aware that the 10,000 lb cap on 3/4 trucks is artificially capped for a number of reasons, but we want to remain totally legal.
That is why we are going with the Durango Half Ton. I am going to have a Pullrite auto sliding hitch installed though the front of the half ton looks like it is contoured for short wheel beds, so may not actually require a slider. Still, want to take no chances.
I'm picking up a predator 3500 watt inverter generator to carry for back up. We are also installing the three camera Furrion system.
We had a 40 ft diesel pusher but sold it two years ago. Getting a 5th wheel and a new truck was our decision this time.
Looking forward to learning more about this RV....
Steve (cypress, texas)
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Post by midlotexan on Aug 10, 2020 16:04:48 GMT -5
This maybe the most talked about thing on any RV forum. As I understand it, and how I based my truck purchase was this,
Hitch weight on trailer, not literature
Weight of hitch
Weight of passengers
Weight of anything in the truck
Weight of anything in trailer, actually 20 % of that weight
Add those all up, and don't exceed payload of tow vehicle
I ended up with about 200 lbs of payload to spare, in my mind
Once we had it weighed, was 165, but since we have removed some things we never use.
See how you stack up
Others on the forum may have a better formula
Kirt
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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 10, 2020 17:15:29 GMT -5
Kirt, that is pretty much how I am looking at it. My wife weighs 135 Hitch weighs 200 Other than a 20 lb puppy 5 lb cage, nothing else will be in truck. I will probably carry a couple empty fuel cans in the bed. On back of trailer installing a carrier to carry Generator... the gen weighs 100 lbs. Leaves us about 1000 lbs or so in the trailer. We will be right at about the total cargo capacity of 2108 lbs. However, we will still be safely under the GAWR (front 6000, rear 6030) It is pretty crazy how little total cargo capacity my truck has. I do understand that figure is a bit artificial, related to the 10k GVWR of all 3/4 ton trucks which is more related to federal taxes and fees on heavy duty vehicles that the actual true cargo capacity. The GAWR is a bit comforting and probably more realistic. I have seen folks towing far heavier 5th wheels with essentially the same vehicle. We had initially planned on a much heavier 5th wheel like the Durango Gold. I honestly did not understand that the limiting factor was the total cargo capacity until after I had purchased a $80k truck. A bit too late. My error and I should have researched it a lot better. Still, by moving to the Durango 1/2 ton, we can move forward and not worry. steve Here is a link to a very good article which explains in depth just how we arrived at the 10k figure and an explanation of why my 2108 total cargo capacity is just a bit de-rated. payload capacity |
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Post by Edd505 on Aug 10, 2020 19:23:46 GMT -5
You have already purchased so you have what you have. If you had posted pre purchase I would have said look at a 3500 SRW, they are not much more than a new 2500 and no worries about weight with that Durango half ton. Travel safe and maybe we'll meet out and about.
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Post by midlotexan on Aug 10, 2020 20:27:11 GMT -5
I went thru the same thing, except we had trailer in mind first, then went from 3/4 to one ton before we bought trailer.
My biggest debate was dually or single rear wheel, did the single.
As my daily driver, just wasn't ready for that extra layer of drama.
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Post by laknox on Aug 12, 2020 13:27:54 GMT -5
I'm assuming that this is the correct forum for the Durango 1/2 ton? We have placed a deposit on a 2021 D283RLT. The advertised specs say a hitch weight of 1310, but the door sticker is 1530 lbs. We purchased a new RAM 2500 Diesel Laramie Longhorn (6ft 5 in bed) to tow a 5th wheel. It has a towing capacity of over 19000 lbs, but a meager total cargo weight capacity of 2108 lbs. (Front axle 6000 and rear axle 6040 GAWR.) I now am aware that we need to stay as close to the 2108 total cargo capacity as possible. I am aware that the 10,000 lb cap on 3/4 trucks is artificially capped for a number of reasons, but we want to remain totally legal. That is why we are going with the Durango Half Ton. I am going to have a Pullrite auto sliding hitch installed though the front of the half ton looks like it is contoured for short wheel beds, so may not actually require a slider. Still, want to take no chances. I'm picking up a predator 3500 watt inverter generator to carry for back up. We are also installing the three camera Furrion system. We had a 40 ft diesel pusher but sold it two years ago. Getting a 5th wheel and a new truck was our decision this time. Looking forward to learning more about this RV.... Steve (cypress, texas) OK, so GVW is 10,500. This means that you're likely going to have 2,100-2,400 on the pin if you're at GVW (20-23%); maybe more. First thing I'd do is ditch the auto-slider for something lighter. 265 lbs just for the hitch. Even a B&W Companion would save you nearly 100 lbs. An Andersen is about 40 lbs for the aluminum version. IMO, you don't need a slider unless you have to back into tight spots frequently. You =can= do an "add-a-leaf" kit that =will= give you more payload, you just need to be sure that your truck's tires will be within spec, or change tires. You'll still be a 3/4t but the actual capacity will be higher. Nobody here will tell anyone. :-) You do have to realize that the published cargo capacity is with a single 150 lb driver and full fuel. Add the hitch, SO, dog, kids, "stuff", and all that comes off the net cargo capacity. Put the genny on the cargo rack on the back of the trailer, and it'll offset about 10-15 lbs of the pin...maybe. If you never travel to BC, you shouldn't have any "legal" issues. BC is probably the worst for actually scaling RVs. FWIW, my old 11,360 GVW Komfort FW put me well over both my payload and my combined weights, but NOT my tires. I never felt I was towing "more than I should" nor did I ever have any issues. Made a couple emergency stops and trailer brakes and truck brakes performed as they should. I only wish I'd had the extra 100+ hp of the later model D'max's to pull it. My current D1500, at 10,500 GVW, 2+' taller and 3' longer, tows much better than the old low-profile FW =and= gives me better mileage, if you can believe that! Just more aerodynamic, even with the larger frontal area. Frankly, I'm still pushing the payload limit, but the next truck will be a 3500, so that won't be an issue. Lyle |
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Post by laknox on Aug 12, 2020 13:28:37 GMT -5
You have already purchased so you have what you have. If you had posted pre purchase I would have said look at a 3500 SRW, they are not much more than a new 2500 and no worries about weight with that Durango half ton. Travel safe and maybe we'll meet out and about. What ^^^he^^^ said! Lyle |
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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 17, 2020 22:08:55 GMT -5
I read an excellent article in 5th wheel mag that had a formula for calculating the actual % of weight that the trailer will place on the hitch. You divide the actual pin weight by the empty weight of the 5th wheel. This gives you an accurate % of weight transferred to hitch. In this case, 1530/8780 yields a 17.4% figure. Loading this to the 10500 GVWR means that there will be a hitch weight of 1827 lbs. The pullrite easy slider 16k model 2700 weighs 200 lbs. my wife is 135lbs. I honestly do not think we will have a problem. I did stop by the dealership and talk about a 1 ton. I would be treated just like I was trading a used truck in. Figure at least a 10k hit for my ignorance . Nope, I will haul the half ton and pay attention to the weight. Thanks guys
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Post by laknox on Aug 18, 2020 10:38:19 GMT -5
I read an excellent article in 5th wheel mag that had a formula for calculating the actual % of weight that the trailer will place on the hitch. You divide the actual pin weight by the empty weight of the 5th wheel. This gives you an accurate % of weight transferred to hitch. In this case, 1530/8780 yields a 17.4% figure. Loading this to the 10500 GVWR means that there will be a hitch weight of 1827 lbs. The pullrite easy slider 16k model 2700 weighs 200 lbs. my wife is 135lbs. I honestly do not think we will have a problem. I did stop by the dealership and talk about a 1 ton. I would be treated just like I was trading a used truck in. Figure at least a 10k hit for my ignorance . Nope, I will haul the half ton and pay attention to the weight. Thanks guys That's just a starting point. Unless you're willing to pull the belly covering from your brand new rig, you have no clue where your tanks are. Every 50 gallons of water is roughly 400 lbs; black water is likely closer to 500 lbs / 50 gal. Depending on where the tanks are, you could easily be adding 300-500 lbs to the pin. Not a problem if you have a short tow to a dump station, but if you have to tow a ways to dump, it =could= be. I'm talking dry camping, here, not if you're at a full hook up or at a campground with a dump station. I =have= had to tow the 140 miles home from our usual boondock site, with near-full black and grey tanks, when my usual dump was closed. Now, had I known what I was in for, I would simply have dumped the grey water in the forest (hell, it can =always= use more water), even if it's not exactly legal, and saved the 300 lbs. Given your numbers, I would say that your pin wt will likely be more towards the 20% range than higher, though. Also, with a FW, if your pin wt's =too= low, then you can start to have handling issues when towing. Light pins are the primary cause of chucking (fore / aft movement of the FW), if my past 13 years of reading various RV fora are correct. (Level towing also helps.) Lastly, once you get your rig and are loaded and ready to go camping, hit a CAT scale and see what your =actual= weights are. If you don't know the procedure, drive the whole rig onto the scale. You'll get steer axle, drive axle and trailer axle(s) weights. Unhitch the FW and drive back onto the scale to weight the truck only. Make sure your load hasn't changed (i.e. DW hasn't run off to the loo). Rehitch and run the numbers. You can now see several things; 1) what your truck weighs loaded prior to hitching; 2) what your combined load is so you can compare with the "book" number; 3) how much your axle weights changed, front and rear. The =rear= difference is the important one as you can see if you've exceeded (or not) your axle and tire ratings and, most importantly, what your actual pin wt is; 4) how much your FW's axles are carrying while loaded. Lyle |
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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 18, 2020 17:48:51 GMT -5
Hi Lyle. We are really more of a campground type RV folks. I would never travel with loaded tanks. I might keep 10 gallons for emergency flush, but I have never traveled with full holding tanks, even with our prior 40 ft DP. When we first started with RV's about 23 years ago, we had a 30 foot TT. Funny, I had a Ford one ton dually at that time so we never worried about weight. We never camped without full hookups. We ran our DAMON 40 FT DP for about 6 years all over Texas, OK, and MO. The closest we ever came to boondocking was pulling into a rest stop for a short nap. I guess we were fortunate as we always had reservations for sites. While we may be at or slightly exceed our total cargo weight, we won't even be close to the GAWR or the load E tires. We have backed off of the Forest River Cardinal Luxury that we wanted as it clearly is too heavy of a pin weight. We have a deposit on the KZ D283RLT. I am a bit dissapointed that the actual pin weight is 1530 lbs and opposed to their advertised 1310, but I assume it is due to the optional 4 point auto level, second AC unit, and other options on the unit. My only other option is to forfeit our $500 deposit and buy a TT with auto level. Since the dealer does not carry Jayco or Grand Design TT with auto level, I would need to go somewhere else. Of course, I have to get a good report from cancer Doc next week or this all is moot. Pretty hard to go camping if you are having surgery and more chemo. The dealership specifically wrote "Cleared by Doctor" as a contingency.
Thanks folks... Steve
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Post by Edd505 on Aug 18, 2020 20:51:34 GMT -5
Hi Lyle. We are really more of a campground type RV folks. I would never travel with loaded tanks. I might keep 10 gallons for emergency flush, but I have never traveled with full holding tanks, even with our prior 40 ft DP. When we first started with RV's about 23 years ago, we had a 30 foot TT. Funny, I had a Ford one ton dually at that time so we never worried about weight. We never camped without full hookups. We ran our DAMON 40 FT DP for about 6 years all over Texas, OK, and MO. The closest we ever came to boondocking was pulling into a rest stop for a short nap. I guess we were fortunate as we always had reservations for sites. While we may be at or slightly exceed our total cargo weight, we won't even be close to the GAWR or the load E tires. We have backed off of the Forest River Cardinal Luxury that we wanted as it clearly is too heavy of a pin weight. We have a deposit on the KZ D283RLT. I am a bit dissapointed that the actual pin weight is 1530 lbs and opposed to their advertised 1310, but I assume it is due to the optional 4 point auto level, second AC unit, and other options on the unit. My only other option is to forfeit our $500 deposit and buy a TT with auto level. Since the dealer does not carry Jayco or Grand Design TT with auto level, I would need to go somewhere else. Of course, I have to get a good report from cancer Doc next week or this all is moot. Pretty hard to go camping if you are having surgery and more chemo. The dealership specifically wrote "Cleared by Doctor" as a contingency. Thanks folks... Steve First good luck with the Dr. visit, wife's 2 year is next month. Now on the RV, with what laknox said you will also be adding weight in the basement, chairs, grills, tools, so the weight will go up. Upgrade the mattress = more weight again and it just keeps adding. I empty it once a year to see what's there I really don't need and straight things out again, just seems to move around during the year. |
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Post by laknox on Aug 19, 2020 10:26:34 GMT -5
Hi Lyle. We are really more of a campground type RV folks. I would never travel with loaded tanks. I might keep 10 gallons for emergency flush, but I have never traveled with full holding tanks, even with our prior 40 ft DP. When we first started with RV's about 23 years ago, we had a 30 foot TT. Funny, I had a Ford one ton dually at that time so we never worried about weight. We never camped without full hookups. We ran our DAMON 40 FT DP for about 6 years all over Texas, OK, and MO. The closest we ever came to boondocking was pulling into a rest stop for a short nap. I guess we were fortunate as we always had reservations for sites. While we may be at or slightly exceed our total cargo weight, we won't even be close to the GAWR or the load E tires. We have backed off of the Forest River Cardinal Luxury that we wanted as it clearly is too heavy of a pin weight. We have a deposit on the KZ D283RLT. I am a bit dissapointed that the actual pin weight is 1530 lbs and opposed to their advertised 1310, but I assume it is due to the optional 4 point auto level, second AC unit, and other options on the unit. My only other option is to forfeit our $500 deposit and buy a TT with auto level. Since the dealer does not carry Jayco or Grand Design TT with auto level, I would need to go somewhere else. Of course, I have to get a good report from cancer Doc next week or this all is moot. Pretty hard to go camping if you are having surgery and more chemo. The dealership specifically wrote "Cleared by Doctor" as a contingency. Thanks folks... Steve Here's to hoping for the best on your treatment and to a good report. That being said, I'm really glad you got that clearance clause written into your contract. Personally, I'd have no problem "fudging" a bit if I wanted out and, frankly, wouldn't worry too much about the dealer. Right now, it's a seller's market and lots around here (PHX, Mesa) are pretty bare and deals are not to be found, whether new or used. Given that you rarely travel with full tanks, you still have to be prepared to do so. Not sure where you travel to, but you simply may not have time to dump in a "bug out" situation though, again personally, I'd have zero issues with yanking the dump cap and opening the grey tank as I drove down the road. I would absolutely NOT dump the fresh water, as you might need it in an emergency. Hell, the hose would likely be the last thing disconnected as I'd have it running to fill my tank until the last second and just leave the hose there. :-) Lyle |
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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 19, 2020 15:03:14 GMT -5
My wife and I have decided not to take any chances. Even though we would still be pretty safe with the 2500, I am at the dealer exchanging it for a 3500 Longhorn 8 foot bed with gooseneck/5th wheel prep.
It’s cargo capacity is 5524 lbs. I doubt we will get the half ton. I still like the Durango Gold. We have no real limits on weight with this truck.
This is an expensive and painful lesson. I will not need an auto slider with this truck. I’m thinking about the Anderson hitch now. I can easily self install as the bed is prepped. FYI that saves me over $1k from installing a pullrite auto slider. Lesson learned.
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Post by laknox on Aug 19, 2020 15:22:44 GMT -5
My wife and I have decided not to take any chances. Even though we would still be pretty safe with the 2500, I am at the dealer exchanging it for a 3500 Longhorn 8 foot bed with gooseneck/5th wheel prep. It’s cargo capacity is 5524 lbs. I doubt we will get the half ton. I still like the Durango Gold. We have no real limits on weight with this truck. This is an expensive and painful lesson. I will not need an auto slider with this truck. I’m thinking about the Anderson hitch now. I can easily self install as the bed is prepped. FYI that saves me over $1k from installing a pullrite auto slider. Lesson learned. Nice! I don't think you'll be unhappy. Since I'm a B&W Fanboy, according to some, I'd heartily recommend the Companion hitch. Lyle |
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Post by stevee9c6 on Aug 19, 2020 16:25:04 GMT -5
I like the Anderson because I can easily remove it myself. It only weighs 40 lbs.
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Post by midlotexan on Aug 19, 2020 18:11:47 GMT -5
Congrats on the new truck. You have may have overkill right now, but....there are a lot of nice trailers out there.
I also have a B and W Companion hitch. It is a 2 piece unit, and when taken apart, they are 40 and 60 lbs a piece more or less.
I have factory pucks and takes me about 5 minutes, from the garage floor to latched in.
Hope to see you on the road, we are going to the Hill Country for a month. Come to the Frio and have a meal!
Safe travels
Kirt
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Post by Edd505 on Aug 19, 2020 20:24:44 GMT -5
My wife and I have decided not to take any chances. Even though we would still be pretty safe with the 2500, I am at the dealer exchanging it for a 3500 Longhorn 8 foot bed with gooseneck/5th wheel prep. It’s cargo capacity is 5524 lbs. I doubt we will get the half ton. I still like the Durango Gold. We have no real limits on weight with this truck. This is an expensive and painful lesson. I will not need an auto slider with this truck. I’m thinking about the Anderson hitch now. I can easily self install as the bed is prepped. FYI that saves me over $1k from installing a pullrite auto slider. Lesson learned. Congratulations! I have never owned a short bed, haul too many sheets of dry wall & plywood, 2x4 studs, etc, slide em in and close the tail gate. Never heard anyone say they had too much truck, you will love the 3500 & long bed. |
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