mwke
Newbie RV’er
Posts: 4 
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Post by mwke on Jan 31, 2018 8:04:52 GMT -5
Good Morning all and thanks for letting me in. Scratching my head at the moment as I am and electrical idiot.
We bought a Sportsman Sportster Toyhauler new in 08. Never once have had a problem. Always parked at the house and plugged in. I have been in and out of the hospital over the past yr so I havent been able to get out there and shake things down. Finally felt good enough on Monday to hook up and at least get the toys out. Had to get out to hit button to raise the landing gear and nothing. Still plugged in to the house Via 50amp shore power cable. Unplugged that and plugged the truck in. Still nothing. Checked fuses everything was fine. Battery Dead. Connected Battery Charger to it and was able to raise my trailer to hook up the truck. Charged battery over night. Battery is toast. Plugged shore power back in with battery still hooked up, very dim lights. AC will not turn on but I have power to ALL the electrical outlets!! Battery indicator on the panel says 2/3 charge and drops to E once I turn on the lights. I can only find people having a problem with the battery not charging. Any Electrical Wizards in here?
Breaking it down.
Dead battery
Shore power very dim lights.
Landing gear does not work while on Shore power but does when on battery charger
All outlets work on shore power.
Truck connection will not work.
Thanks in advance,
Craig
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Post by ifulltime on Jan 31, 2018 8:51:08 GMT -5
Hey Craig, I would replace the trailers house battery with a new one. I helped someone move there trailer one time who had a known bad battery, and it had enough power to get the trailer on the truck, but when we got over to storage it wouldn't lift the trailer to take it off. I had unplugged from the truck the first time we tried so I had hoped the trucks battery would do it through the battery charge wire. Instead it just blew the fuse on the truck. I had no jumper cables so we had to wait for someone to come along who did. Soon as we jumped out the battery to a running vehicle we got the trailer off. The AC needs 12 volt for thermostat power also. Good luck and glad you are feeling better.
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Post by lynnmor on Jan 31, 2018 9:17:52 GMT -5
You need a voltmeter. Check the voltage at the battery, it should be over 13 volts when the trailer is plugged in. If not, snap the breakers on and off and check again. If still under 13 volts, check that you are getting 120 volt power to the converter. If you have no 120 volt power, you need to find where that problem lies. If you have power, then check the output terminals at the converter to see if you have over 13 volts there. If no output, the converter is toast.
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Post by doublewa on Jan 31, 2018 10:02:27 GMT -5
I'm with Lynnmor on this Craig. I have a 2018 Sportster TH and I just went through a doozie with my backup camera. However, in doing so (and listening to some of the commenters here) I learned A TON about my RV's electrical systems.
You're battery is more than likely toast. Even if you did charge it, it probably has damage. Best bet is to replace it anyways. That will eliminate one probable cause. Like Lynnmor said, if you aren't getting more than 13 volts at the battery, chances are your converter is shot. Is it still the original from 2008? If it is, I'm leaning even more towards your converter. Good news is, they are not any more expensive than a battery and you should be able to find an OEM replacement online fairly easily. I'm willing to be that's your issue. Again, a voltmeter will tell you for sure. If you don't have one already, invest in a Fluke. The time and aggravation they will save you is beyond their weight in gold.
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Post by lynnmor on Jan 31, 2018 10:53:29 GMT -5
A Fluke is a fine piece of equipment, but the cheapest thing out there is good enough for this testing. One can be had for cheap, and even free at Harbor Freight. If you need a converter, know that the OEM models are the cheapest out there and many fail. Call Best Converter with your converter model number and they will direct you to the one best suited for your needs. Let us know about your progress. |
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Post by ifulltime on Jan 31, 2018 11:02:46 GMT -5
You already know the battery is toast. The likely reason it is toast is due to being hooked up to shore power for an extended period with no maintenance. If you plan on leaving the trailer on shore power I would suggest replacing the converter with a properly sized Progressive Dynamics or Iota. The other alternative is to stick with the OEM converter and use a manifold watering system in place of your new batteries caps to make adding water to them easy and keep a regular schedule with adding water.
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Post by kaboom on Jan 31, 2018 11:33:40 GMT -5
I agree with the need for a voltmeter of some type. If you don't have one then I'd take the battery and have it load tested. Most auto parts stores could do this test for free. While I was there, I'd buy a multi meter. Doesn't have to be an expensive brand or model.
My understanding is if the battery is bad the 12 volt system' will not work properly even though the RV is plugged into 120 volt.
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Post by doublewa on Jan 31, 2018 11:52:49 GMT -5
I agree with the need for a voltmeter of some type. If you don't have one then I'd take the battery and have it load tested. Most auto parts stores could do this test for free. While I was there, I'd buy a multi meter. Doesn't have to be an expensive brand or model. My understanding is if the battery is bad the 12 volt system' will not work properly even though the RV is plugged into 120 volt. That's absolutely correct. The 12v DC system hooked to the battery and the 120v AC shore power are completely different electrical systems. They really don't have much to do with one another other than the converter (which for those that don't know) converts 120V AC power to 12V DC power to recharge the batteries. 12V power comes from the batteries when needed. The converter replenishes the batteries by converting that 120v to 12v. This is an oversimplification and gets talked about alot, but it never hurts repeating as there are always some newbies out there that are learning this for the first time. I was one myself not too long ago  |
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Post by lynnmor on Jan 31, 2018 11:54:41 GMT -5
My understanding is if the battery is bad the 12 volt system' will not work properly even though the RV is plugged into 120 volt. Actually it will work just fine. Things that take a lot of power, like a large power awning may not function correctly without assist from a good battery. If the battery is installed, and is in very bad condition, it could cause an issue and he should test the voltage with the battery both connected and disconnected. The WFCO converters usually installed as OEM have a bad reputation and if it needs replaced, I would use a different brand. Many people trust the converter to maintain the battery over extended periods, I don't. I use a disconnect switch as soon as parked and charge the battery monthly with a Battery Tender charger. This has the added benefit of keeping the trailer isolated from the power grid most of the time and not subject to problems from there. |
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Post by ifulltime on Jan 31, 2018 12:21:22 GMT -5
It really would be nice if they made converters an upgrade option. My mother-in-law has a 100,000 dollar Cedar Creek that had dual WFCO converters hooked in parallel from the factory. In short order she had lights going bright and dim every 2 seconds as the converter chargers fought each other. I replaced the WFCO units with two iotas that are designed to be paralleled and she has had good service from them for two years of almost continuous shore power. I'm a pants and suspenders type though and do both the better converter and watering manifolds.  |
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Post by doublewa on Jan 31, 2018 12:37:29 GMT -5
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Post by ifulltime on Jan 31, 2018 12:56:25 GMT -5
In the pic I posted, you can see the top shelf holds a Magnum Inverter/charger. This takes care of the 2 deep cycles on the right and is kept separate for our residential fridge. The left battery is our house battery and is charged by a separate converter/charger. I like the idea of having separate house batteries and inverter batteries. But once again the whole pants and suspenders thing.  |
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mwke
Newbie RV’er
Posts: 4
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Post by mwke on Jan 31, 2018 20:30:03 GMT -5
Thanks for all the Replies!!!! Ill check into all these suggestions on Friday. One thing I forgot to mention, The Air Conditioner will not turn on with the shore power either. I know that doesnt run on 12V. Power to all the sockets but not the AC.
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Post by nvguy on Jan 31, 2018 23:33:54 GMT -5
Yep, the A/C is 110, but the control is 12 V, having a dead battery can create all sorts of strange things. Reason being is a dead battery is also in many cases a damaged battery, in that lead sloughs off the plates and creates internal shorts, or sulfates up and just wont take a charge. Another thing a battery does is provide an electrical "cushion" for the converter. What does all this mean? The factory converter (which isn't all that smart or well engineered) freaks out and produces over voltage / amps this is turn can damage boards, and blow fuses.
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mwke
Newbie RV’er
Posts: 4
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Post by mwke on Feb 5, 2018 7:55:08 GMT -5
Didnt want you all to think I "Hit and Ran"!! Didnt have a chance to tackle this yet. Had to finish another project first. The Honey Do list seems to have gotten longer!! I will update again this weekend
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mwke
Newbie RV’er
Posts: 4
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Post by mwke on Feb 17, 2018 7:12:17 GMT -5
Good Morning,,,, I FINALLY had the time yesterday.. While pulling the old battery( 7yrs old!!) I noticed that there were two ground wires loose and dangling just under the block they were supposed to be in. I am thinking that over time they just worked themselves out. There really isnt a possibility of them getting snagged on anything way back in there. Long story short, everything works as it should now. Thanks for everyone's help. It is MUCH appreciated. BTW, I REALLY wish KZ would have put an exterior door to the battery compartment. WHAT A PITA for cripple like me.
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Post by lynnmor on Feb 17, 2018 9:05:27 GMT -5
I noticed that there were two ground wires loose and dangling just under the block they were supposed to be in. I am thinking that over time they just worked themselves out. This is a good time for everyone to check for loose wires. I have found some that were completely loose from new, and that can be a fire hazard. Yes, they tend to loosen over time, but sometimes they were never tight on day one. A grounding block on the frame should be checked to be sure the unlike metals didn't start to corrode. If you have a twist-lock type connection for the power cord, be aware that the screws on the inside can be loose, and that is difficult to check, but loose wires in the trailer wall is the fire hazard I found. |
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Post by ifulltime on Feb 18, 2018 11:39:34 GMT -5
I noticed that there were two ground wires loose and dangling just under the block they were supposed to be in. I am thinking that over time they just worked themselves out. This is a good time for everyone to check for loose wires. I have found some that were completely loose from new, and that can be a fire hazard. Yes, they tend to loosen over time, but sometimes they were never tight on day one. A grounding block on the frame should be checked to be sure the unlike metals didn't start to corrode. If you have a twist-lock type connection for the power cord, be aware that the screws on the inside can be loose, and that is difficult to check, but loose wires in the trailer wall is the fire hazard I found. That is one thing I was impressed with on our 2018 KZ over our 2008 is that the 2018 has PT (crimped permanent terminations) on all the wires in the walls. The wiring in general between 2008 and 2018 is a huge improvement. |
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