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Post by mdcamper on Jul 31, 2019 19:37:17 GMT -5
I am not going to rehash our de-lamination issue from the factory in this thread but you can read about it here and keep up to date with our saga to get it resolved to our satisfaction but it is just the beginning of many issues we are having with the less then a year old Durango. Recently during our trip to TN we had numerous thing happen and one of them was a very serious problem that could have resulted in a fire and possible injury or loss of life. A number of the problems are not related to third party equipment - I wanted to make it clear that these are quality control issues with this coach (KZ in general?) Right before our trip the bathroom wall outlet pulled right out of the wall. The ears that lock it in to place crumbled off. I had to do a quick emergency fix with JB weld. I talked with KZ, they said that they would get a part out to me after I sent them pictures which I did. I followed up and they said they would get it out to me as soon as the factory had it. This was over a month and half ago and I have still not received the part. Also before the trip one of the tires kept loosing pressure. Took it to a tire shop and it was determined that the valve stem was ripped. Repaired on my own dime. The big one that had me fuming during our trip is this. We arrived at our final destination on the way home in southern VA. It was a state park. I plugged in to 30 amp with an adapter and waited for the surge guard to count down. It said everything was good to go. I flipped the breaker inside the coach and heard a whine from the converter then a sparking sound. I quickly shut off the breaker and opened up the basement door and see a puff of smoke and burning plastic/electrical smell. I could tell the smell was coming from the inverter so I took off the panel and noticed that the 110 line neutral to the breaker box was toast (see below) The wire had cooked and it took most of the green plastic with it. When I took the unit down I noticed that none of the wires were properly installed in to the inverter! This inverter has a tricky connector that must be operated correctly in order to have the wires grab correctly. The neutral was likely not installed properly and hanging by a thread! This caused an arc and short circuit.
Also during the trip our solar control panel stopped working. So I investigated and determine that both positive and negative wire crimps at the battery were crap. When I returned home I repaired it right and it should never fail again. On our latest trip, the bathroom vanity has separated from the wall! (See picture). At the same stop we noticed the molding on the side of the camp side slide out was bowing significantly. I put pro-flex on it but this is not simply the joint failing - the entire piece of molding was connected to the wall is no longer.
While looking underneath the same slide I noticed that the luan in this area is not finished off at all and exposed the elements.  The same wall is bowed underneath and you can see the insulation and carpet from the inside of the coach. (See pictures)
On the same slide out there are multiple areas of the plastic flooring area that have deep gouges in them from something scraping the underside of the floor.
The plastic battery/storage tray area is warping and pulling away from the wall inside the basement. The only thing on this is the 2 batteries and a few smalll odds and ends. The above are poor QC/workmanship on the part of KZ. I realize that campers fall apart from driving down the road and such but these are things that should have been done correctly the first time at the factory. Unfortunately this is just the major stuff. There are some additional minor things like screws that have already backed out of the ladder, screws that hold the lower trim outside breaking off etc.
I really had so many plans for this coach that are now on hold like electric door locks, Lithium batteries for the solar system etc. At this point I don't want to drop another dime on the camper cause I'm not sure it will hold up to the test of time.
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Post by mdcamper on Jul 31, 2019 19:41:13 GMT -5
Here is a shot of the bowing slide out. Kinda hard to see but if you look closely you can see there is a gap that narrows at each end of the photo.
Here is the bathroom vanity that pulled away from the wall. It completely disconnected from the cabinet beside it as well.
We also have multiple cabinet doors warping and no longer close and look nice as well.
Here is a shot of the plastic warping near where the batteries sit.
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Post by Chuck on Jul 31, 2019 21:11:11 GMT -5
Sorry to here about all this. I believe a trip back to the factory is in order, I'm surprised that your dealer an Kz both have suggest such ... Some of us have had problems but not as many an surly not the major problems your having ... We have had lose screws in the fenders an skirting, but I fixed those with little square aluminum block behind both so the screws had something to hold onto besides the thin sheet metal ... We have also had inside trim molding come off on the floor an one of slide slid, fixed with liquid nails an some screws ... So we have been pretty lucky I would say, the overhead light in the bathroom started to act up this trip out, flickers but won't come on, so I'm going to ask if they will look at it while at the rally really quickly or maybe a Monday morning stop at the factory when we leave  Good luck with everything, I hope that Kz will step up to the plate which I believe they will Safe Travels Chuck |
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Post by mdcamper on Jul 31, 2019 22:20:45 GMT -5
Sorry to here about all this. I believe a trip back to the factory is in order, I'm surprised that your dealer an Kz both have suggest such ... Some of us have had problems but not as many an surly not the major problems your having ... We have had lose screws in the fenders an skirting, but I fixed those with little square aluminum block behind both so the screws had something to hold onto besides the thin sheet metal ... We have also had inside trim molding come off on the floor an one of slide slid, fixed with liquid nails an some screws ... So we have been pretty lucky I would say, the overhead light in the bathroom started to act up this trip out, flickers but won't come on, so I'm going to ask if they will look at it while at the rally really quickly or maybe a Monday morning stop at the factory when we leave Good luck with everything, I hope that Kz will step up to the plate which I believe they will Safe Travels Chuck
Its crazy Chuck. When we got this camper, as you remember, it looked like we had very few problems aside from some cosmetic. I know the dealer wants the RV to go back to the factory but as of now, they don't want it back - at least for the de-lamination.
I really wish we could have made the rally next week so we could speak to reps directly and they could see the issues we have first hand. |
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Post by Chuck on Aug 1, 2019 13:39:37 GMT -5
mdcamper I am really surprised that Kz is balking on taking the trailer back, they have bent over backwards for us an a number of other owner's on different things to include checking on frame flex on the front ends of Durango |
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 1, 2019 16:13:04 GMT -5
mdcamper I am really surprised that Kz is balking on taking the trailer back, they have bent over backwards for us an a number of other owner's on different things to include checking on frame flex on the front ends of Durango I have no idea why. Maybe we just have not talked to the right person. The dealer showed me the response from them and they said no, they would not take the trailer back and to get a local quote. When I talked directly to KZ they said that I had to go through my dealer for the warranty work.
This is just a huge, sad and disgusting mess.
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Post by nvguy on Aug 2, 2019 20:45:44 GMT -5
I really hate to hear you have to go thru the dealer, as who knows what they are telling KZ.
I don't know how anyone can think a local body shop can repair delamination. And all these other items warrant some factory attention. Perhaps one of the rally participants can quietly mention your case to a KZ rep in an attempt to shine some factory light on this.
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Post by Edd505 on Aug 2, 2019 20:50:23 GMT -5
I am not going to rehash our de-lamination issue from the factory in this thread but you can read about it here and keep up to date with our saga to get it resolved to our satisfaction but it is just the beginning of many issues we are having with the less then a year old Durango. Recently during our trip to TN we had numerous thing happen and one of them was a very serious problem that could have resulted in a fire and possible injury or loss of life. A number of the problems are not related to third party equipment - I wanted to make it clear that these are quality control issues with this coach (KZ in general?) Right before our trip the bathroom wall outlet pulled right out of the wall. The ears that lock it in to place crumbled off. I had to do a quick emergency fix with JB weld. I talked with KZ, they said that they would get a part out to me after I sent them pictures which I did. I followed up and they said they would get it out to me as soon as the factory had it. This was over a month and half ago and I have still not received the part. Also before the trip one of the tires kept loosing pressure. Took it to a tire shop and it was determined that the valve stem was ripped. Repaired on my own dime. The big one that had me fuming during our trip is this. We arrived at our final destination on the way home in southern VA. It was a state park. I plugged in to 30 amp with an adapter and waited for the surge guard to count down. It said everything was good to go. I flipped the breaker inside the coach and heard a whine from the converter then a sparking sound. I quickly shut off the breaker and opened up the basement door and see a puff of smoke and burning plastic/electrical smell. I could tell the smell was coming from the inverter so I took off the panel and noticed that the 110 line neutral to the breaker box was toast (see below) The wire had cooked and it took most of the green plastic with it. When I took the unit down I noticed that none of the wires were properly installed in to the inverter! This inverter has a tricky connector that must be operated correctly in order to have the wires grab correctly. The neutral was likely not installed properly and hanging by a thread! This caused an arc and short circuit.
Also during the trip our solar control panel stopped working. So I investigated and determine that both positive and negative wire crimps at the battery were crap. When I returned home I repaired it right and it should never fail again. On our latest trip, the bathroom vanity has separated from the wall! (See picture). At the same stop we noticed the molding on the side of the camp side slide out was bowing significantly. I put pro-flex on it but this is not simply the joint failing - the entire piece of molding was connected to the wall is no longer.
While looking underneath the same slide I noticed that the luan in this area is not finished off at all and exposed the elements. The same wall is bowed underneath and you can see the insulation and carpet from the inside of the coach. (See pictures)
On the same slide out there are multiple areas of the plastic flooring area that have deep gouges in them from something scraping the underside of the floor.
The plastic battery/storage tray area is warping and pulling away from the wall inside the basement. The only thing on this is the 2 batteries and a few smalll odds and ends.The above are poor QC/workmanship on the part of KZ. I realize that campers fall apart from driving down the road and such but these are things that should have been done correctly the first time at the factory. Unfortunately this is just the major stuff. There are some additional minor things like screws that have already backed out of the ladder, screws that hold the lower trim outside breaking off etc.
I really had so many plans for this coach that are now on hold like electric door locks, Lithium batteries for the solar system etc. At this point I don't want to drop another dime on the camper cause I'm not sure it will hold up to the test of time.
Not to be a butt but didn't you do some major electrical work on that RV, I'm sure it wasn't with battery/electric connected. kzfamilyforum.com/thread/2689/installing-hardwired-surge-protector-powerkzfamilyforum.com/thread/2680/installing-factory-inverter-remote-panelkzfamilyforum.com/thread/2728/installtion-haloview-backup-observation-camera |
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 2, 2019 23:11:05 GMT -5
I really hate to hear you have to go thru the dealer, as who knows what they are telling KZ. I don't know how anyone can think a local body shop can repair delamination. And all these other items warrant some factory attention. Perhaps one of the rally participants can quietly mention your case to a KZ rep in an attempt to shine some factory light on this.
We agree with you. I have yet another call in to KZ customer service and they got back to me when I was not able to get to my phone so I will be calling them back on Monday to see if we can get this ball rolling in the right direction for us.
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 2, 2019 23:20:27 GMT -5
I am not going to rehash our de-lamination issue from the factory in this thread but you can read about it here and keep up to date with our saga to get it resolved to our satisfaction but it is just the beginning of many issues we are having with the less then a year old Durango. Recently during our trip to TN we had numerous thing happen and one of them was a very serious problem that could have resulted in a fire and possible injury or loss of life. A number of the problems are not related to third party equipment - I wanted to make it clear that these are quality control issues with this coach (KZ in general?) Right before our trip the bathroom wall outlet pulled right out of the wall. The ears that lock it in to place crumbled off. I had to do a quick emergency fix with JB weld. I talked with KZ, they said that they would get a part out to me after I sent them pictures which I did. I followed up and they said they would get it out to me as soon as the factory had it. This was over a month and half ago and I have still not received the part. Also before the trip one of the tires kept loosing pressure. Took it to a tire shop and it was determined that the valve stem was ripped. Repaired on my own dime. The big one that had me fuming during our trip is this. We arrived at our final destination on the way home in southern VA. It was a state park. I plugged in to 30 amp with an adapter and waited for the surge guard to count down. It said everything was good to go. I flipped the breaker inside the coach and heard a whine from the converter then a sparking sound. I quickly shut off the breaker and opened up the basement door and see a puff of smoke and burning plastic/electrical smell. I could tell the smell was coming from the inverter so I took off the panel and noticed that the 110 line neutral to the breaker box was toast (see below) The wire had cooked and it took most of the green plastic with it. When I took the unit down I noticed that none of the wires were properly installed in to the inverter! This inverter has a tricky connector that must be operated correctly in order to have the wires grab correctly. The neutral was likely not installed properly and hanging by a thread! This caused an arc and short circuit.
Also during the trip our solar control panel stopped working. So I investigated and determine that both positive and negative wire crimps at the battery were crap. When I returned home I repaired it right and it should never fail again. On our latest trip, the bathroom vanity has separated from the wall! (See picture). At the same stop we noticed the molding on the side of the camp side slide out was bowing significantly. I put pro-flex on it but this is not simply the joint failing - the entire piece of molding was connected to the wall is no longer.
While looking underneath the same slide I noticed that the luan in this area is not finished off at all and exposed the elements. The same wall is bowed underneath and you can see the insulation and carpet from the inside of the coach. (See pictures)
On the same slide out there are multiple areas of the plastic flooring area that have deep gouges in them from something scraping the underside of the floor.
The plastic battery/storage tray area is warping and pulling away from the wall inside the basement. The only thing on this is the 2 batteries and a few smalll odds and ends.The above are poor QC/workmanship on the part of KZ. I realize that campers fall apart from driving down the road and such but these are things that should have been done correctly the first time at the factory. Unfortunately this is just the major stuff. There are some additional minor things like screws that have already backed out of the ladder, screws that hold the lower trim outside breaking off etc.
I really had so many plans for this coach that are now on hold like electric door locks, Lithium batteries for the solar system etc. At this point I don't want to drop another dime on the camper cause I'm not sure it will hold up to the test of time.
Not to be a butt but didn't you do some major electrical work on that RV, I'm sure it wasn't with battery/electric connected. kzfamilyforum.com/thread/2689/installing-hardwired-surge-protector-powerkzfamilyforum.com/thread/2680/installing-factory-inverter-remote-panelkzfamilyforum.com/thread/2728/installtion-haloview-backup-observation-camera
Edd, Of course it wasn't connected to power. It was at the storage lot with no power. And I am not keen on dying.  What I did with the shore power was not anywhere near that. The inverter is mounted upside down on the ceiling of the RV near the batterys. The only thing I did with that until now was plug an RJ11 plug (i.e. phone cord) in to it (outside of the inverter) that was connected at the other end with the remote panel. These connectors and wires were behind a door on the inverter that was held closed with a thumb screw.
The stuff I worked on was the 50 amp wiring as it comes in to the coach. All of that is done correctly. ;-) I work with cabling/wire almost every day that has to stand up to county and city electrical codes. The inverter wiring was not installed properly. The one neutral wire was completely out of its connector and 4 others were just shoved in to the other connectors with just barely a connection being made. I personally had never seen this style of connector before and had to research how it is used in 110v applications. You have to use a screw driver and push in and pull down to get the "jaws" to open up and accept the wire, then release.
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 2, 2019 23:27:51 GMT -5
While we are on the subject of the surge guard. I never mentioned in my videos when I was working on the installation and had the breaker panel opened and disconnecting and reconnecting wires, before I started I also noticed that several of the wires - neutrals and hots had insulation missing from the wires near the terminations. I corrected the problem as best I could without pulling new wire. While KZ was building this unit had they noticed this they should have rectified the situation by pulling new cable. At the very least protect the bare wire! They failed to do that. That was another possible fire/shock hazard for sure.
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Post by laknox on Aug 6, 2019 12:42:00 GMT -5
While we are on the subject of the surge guard. I never mentioned in my videos when I was working on the installation and had the breaker panel opened and disconnecting and reconnecting wires, before I started I also noticed that several of the wires - neutrals and hots had insulation missing from the wires near the terminations. I corrected the problem as best I could without pulling new wire. While KZ was building this unit had they noticed this they should have rectified the situation by pulling new cable. At the very least protect the bare wire! They failed to do that. That was another possible fire/shock hazard for sure. Man, I sure hope you've documented all this with pictures. Pre-Thor KZ likely would have had some words with the guys on the line over that, from what I can tell. Now, it's just "shove 'em out". :-( Lyle |
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Post by Chuck on Aug 6, 2019 22:23:43 GMT -5
I really hate to hear you have to go thru the dealer, as who knows what they are telling KZ. I don't know how anyone can think a local body shop can repair de lamination. And all these other items warrant some factory attention. Perhaps one of the rally participants can quietly mention your case to a KZ rep in an attempt to shine some factory light on this. I'm with nvguy, even thought the dealer may have showed you correspondence, have they showed you all if it, I have to tell you since Monday there has been service people from Kz an LCI all round us like a swarm of bees fixing all finds of things, nothing I would say really major except for the LCI guys who had one trailers hubs off repacking bearings replacing some minor parts an replacing spring bushings ...
There is one older trailer (5 Years old) that is going to be left after the rally an having work done, they made an appointment to have some major work
done, an Kz has welcomed them with open arms ... So Kz saying they don't want the trailer back really puzzles me, maybe it over transporting back to the
dealer, possibly the dealer dozen't want to share cost or something else ...
I can not promise anything but I may try an show the Kz service manager this thread if I can catch him when he has a minute but again no promises...
Send me a PM with You name an the dealers name an Vin & model number of your trailer
Chuck
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 6, 2019 23:12:27 GMT -5
Thanks Chuck. PM sent.
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Post by mdcamper on Aug 17, 2019 10:17:30 GMT -5
Well I spoke with a fine gentleman at KZ customer service over the past two weeks and we are bringing the Durango up to Indiana soon to have them do all of the repairs and look at the side wall issue.
My wife and I will be towing it up and spending a few nights in the area before dropping it off and going over the issues with KZ. I should know in the next couple of weeks when we will be dropping it off. They will likely have it for at least part of the fall and winter. Maybe in to the spring. We'll see what they think about the side wall issues. I will report back soon.
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Post by nvguy on Aug 17, 2019 23:12:33 GMT -5
Amazing what happens once you get the dealer out of the way. Hoping for the best for you.
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Post by laknox on Aug 19, 2019 10:54:10 GMT -5
Amazing what happens once you get the dealer out of the way. Hoping for the best for you. Even more amazing when you start talking potential FIRE issues, especially with someone who knows WTF they're talking about when it comes to wiring =and= documented it. Can you imagine the liability they'd face if the worst happened?! I'm sure the company attorneys said "get that thing here as soon as you can and get it fixed RIGHT!" Lyle |
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Post by Chuck on Aug 23, 2019 8:01:38 GMT -5
Lyle What you have stated may be a little true, but if you met the service manager an service people from Kz you would understand that they are all about standing up for owners an their products I have now met an worked with the service managers an staff now for over three years all have bent over backwards to help owners at the Kz rally's an beyond from what I have seen an experienced ... If you ask anyone who has been at a Kz rally or visited the Kz factory they can tell you the staff dozen't hide an welcome you, listen to your problems an go out of their way to do what ever possible with reason to help you ...
Every time I have ask for service from the factory they have never said no, every time I have called CS at Kz they have either answered
the phone or called me back within a day ... Maybe I am one of the lucky owners of their product that I have been treated very well, but I am not the only one, there have been a number of us on this form that can say the same thing about Kz but not always about the dealers who may sell Kz products ...
Safe Travels
Chuck
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Post by laknox on Aug 23, 2019 10:05:22 GMT -5
Lyle What you have stated may be a little true, but if you met the service manager an service people from Kz you would understand that they are all about standing up for owners an their products I have now met an worked with the service managers an staff now for over three years all have bent over backwards to help owners at the Kz rally's an beyond from what I have seen an experienced ... If you ask anyone who has been at a Kz rally or visited the Kz factory they can tell you the staff dozen't hide an welcome you, listen to your problems an go out of their way to do what ever possible with reason to help you ...
Every time I have ask for service from the factory they have never said no, every time I have called CS at Kz they have either answered
the phone or called me back within a day ... Maybe I am one of the lucky owners of their product that I have been treated very well, but I am not the only one, there have been a number of us on this form that can say the same thing about Kz but not always about the dealers who may sell Kz products ...
Safe Travels
Chuck
Glad you're having good luck with KZ, Chuck. There =are= others who have posted her who seem to not had such luck. Maybe it's because you attend the rallies, get to know people and you're a frequent poster here, and elsewhere, that they take care of you. They don't want you posting negative stuff. Cynical? Yeah, but the "state of the industry" is enough to make anyone so. I just wish the Rally was 2-3 weeks different, as it's always the same weekend of our family campout and some of the family we only get to see rarely, so we try not to miss it. Lyle |
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Post by Chuck on Aug 25, 2019 8:29:49 GMT -5
Lyle What you have stated may be a little true, but if you met the service manager an service people from Kz you would understand that they are all about standing up for owners an their products I have now met an worked with the service managers an staff now for over three years all have bent over backwards to help owners at the Kz rally's an beyond from what I have seen an experienced ... If you ask anyone who has been at a Kz rally or visited the Kz factory they can tell you the staff dozen't hide an welcome you, listen to your problems an go out of their way to do what ever possible with reason to help you ...
Every time I have ask for service from the factory they have never said no, every time I have called CS at Kz they have either answered
the phone or called me back within a day ... Maybe I am one of the lucky owners of their product that I have been treated very well, but I am not the only one, there have been a number of us on this form that can say the same thing about Kz but not always about the dealers who may sell Kz products ...
Safe Travels
Chuck
Glad you're having good luck with KZ, Chuck. There =are= others who have posted her who seem to not had such luck. Maybe it's because you attend the rallies, get to know people and you're a frequent poster here, and elsewhere, that they take care of you. They don't want you posting negative stuff. Cynical? Yeah, but the "state of the industry" is enough to make anyone so. I just wish the Rally was 2-3 weeks different, as it's always the same weekend of our family campout and some of the family we only get to see rarely, so we try not to miss it. Lyle Well Lyle
I believe it may be some of what you say is true, but even owners that have not attended the rally an just stopped by the Kz plant have been treated pretty darn well an with a great deal of respect as they have stated here on the form ...
I believe if you treat people with respect from the get go until proven otherwise they will bend over backwards to help you ... I have always lived by that rule an it has worked well for me, I also will go out of my way to help others if I can ...
As far as the rally being at a different time I don't believe they really can't do to the fact they are changing out models an getting ready for the upcoming year, it's hard to say, the rally is just one function among many things that is going on...
Safe travels
Chuck
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The same wall is bowed underneath and you can see the insulation and carpet from the inside of the coach. (See pictures)
